50,000 Iraqis Or 570,000 Americans?

50, viagra sale ampoule 000 Iraqis have died says themedical 0, cialis 4970736.story?coll=la-home-headlines”> LA Times

Proportionately, it is equivalent to 570,000 Americans being killed nationwide in the last three years… [ht: Sunni Sister]

…But would anyone notice?


  • I’m not exactly sure how this whole “oil” argument plays out. I see how it would potentially make sense, but practically, it does not. So either the administration is full of complete morons (a distinct possibility), or oil is a red herring.

    As for the deaths of the Iraqis, well… Poor people’s lives are usually discounted. I know that, because I’m Ukrainian-born. When I got my American citizenship, all of us joked that I have “rights” now. Hardy har har.

  • You can also take the number of Iraqi civilians who died because of the war and compare it to the number of American civilians who died in September 11th and see that the war on Iraq has been the equivalent of more than a hundred September 11ths.

  • Hi Nas, it’s me Robin from over on Sabbah’s blog. I just wanted to let you know that there is a growing movement against the war here in the States. Thank GOD!it’s taken WAY TOO LONG. Yesterday I drove 225 miles round trip down to San Diego to attend a small rally in support of a young lieutenant, Ehren Watada of Hawaii, who is the first comminsionded officer to refuse redepoloyment to Iraq. He was arrested last Thursday and is in the stockade at Fort Lewis in Washington State. You can learn more about him here http://www.couragetoresist.org/x/content/view/98/27/ which is an organization supporting all military wanting to get out because they know the war is wrong and here http://www.thankyoult.org/ which is a site all about Ehren. His words are strong. He will uphold our Constitution by REFUSING to participate in an illegal war. I have a copy of the speech outlining all the particular illegalities, the breaking of the Nuremberg principals given by an attorney yesterday if you would like me to email it to you. Just let me know. It might have been a small group yesterday, only about 50, but the ENERGY was AWESOME. I took my nine year old and 16 year old. My sixteen year old was crying, and she is NOT the type to cry. There were several news channels there, including FOX! which was the first to pack up and leave before the speakers even began. They are planning massive rallies in August when Ehren’s hearing comes down. It IS happening, people ARE beginning to speak out publically more against this fascist regime we are living under. I lived through the Viet Nam war, one more American debacle, and this believe me is much much worse.

  • One more thing, yesterday there were thirty rallies nationwide in support of Ehren and ending the war. Although the one in San Diego was small, I’ve heard some of the others were much larger.
    Here is the speech which I’m copying and pasting from my email.

    For background, see:
    Navy Judge Finds War Protest Reasonable â?¢

    First Officer Publicly Resists War
    By Marjorie Cohn
    t r u t h o u t | Perspective

    Thursday 08 June 2006

    Yesterday, US Army First Lieutenant Ehren Watada became the first officer to publicly state his refusal to obey an order to deploy to Iraq. Lieutenant Watada said at a press conference in Tacoma, Washington, “The war in Iraq is in fact illegal. It is my obligation and my duty to refuse any orders to participate in this war.” He stated, “An order to take part in an illegal war is unlawful in itself. So my obligation is not to follow the order to go to Iraq.”

    Citing “deception and manipulation â?¦ and willful misconduct by the highest levels of my chain of command,” Lt. Watada declared there is “no greater betrayal to the American people” than the Iraq war.

    The “turning point” for Lt. Watada came when he “saw the pain and suffering of so many soldiers and their families, and innocent Iraqis.” He said, “I best serve my soldiers by speaking out against unlawful orders of the highest levels of my chain of command, and making sure our leaders are held accountable.” Lt. Watada felt he “had the obligation to step up and do whatever it takes,” even if that means facing court-martial and imprisonment.

    Lt. Watada asked me to speak about the legality of the war at his press conference.

    I cited the Nuremberg Charter, which set forth the three most serious crimes: crimes against the peace, war crimes, and crimes against humanity. The US Army Field Manual 27-10, art. 28, incorporates the prohibition against these three crimes. The United States is committing a crime against the peace, war crimes, and crimes against humanity in Iraq.

    The United States Is Committing a Crime Against the Peace in Iraq

    The Nuremberg Tribunal called the waging of aggressive war “essentially an evil thing … to initiate a war of aggression … is not only an international crime; it is the supreme international crime differing only from other war crimes in that it contains within itself the accumulated evil of the whole.”

    A war of aggression, prosecuted in violation of international treaties, is a crime against the peace. The war in Iraq violates the Charter of the United Nations, which prohibits the use of force. There are only two exceptions to that prohibition: self-defense and approval by the Security Council. A pre-emptive or preventive war is not allowed under the Charter.

    Bush’s war in Iraq was not undertaken in self-defense. Iraq had not attacked the US, or any other country, for 12 years. And Saddam Hussein’s military capability had been effectively neutered by the Gulf War, 12 years of punishing sanctions, and nearly daily bombing by the US and UK over the “no-fly-zones.”

    Bush tried mightily to get the Security Council to sanction his war on Iraq. But the Council refused to give its stamp of approval. Bush then cobbled together prior Council resolutions, none of which, individually or collectively, authorized the use of force in Iraq. Although Bush claimed to be enforcing Security Council resolutions, the Charter empowers only the Council to enforce its resolutions.

    Moreover, the Constitution gives only Congress, not the President, the authority to declare war. Congress cannot delegate that authority to the President. Even if Congress could delegate the war power to the President, it cannot authorize the President to execute an aggressive war.

    The United States Is Committing War Crimes in Iraq

    Violations of the laws of war, memorialized in the Hague and Geneva Conventions, constitute war crimes.

    All four Geneva Conventions have the same article 3, frequently referred to as Article 3 Common. Its terms apply to everyone, not just prisoners of war. It prohibits violence to life and person, murder, mutilation, cruel treatment, torture, and outrages upon personal dignity, particularly humiliating and degrading treatment. These prohibitions are memorialized in the Army Field Manual 27-10, art. 506. The Pentagon is trying to remove Article 3 Common from the newly revised instructions that go with the Manual. The implication is that the Defense Department intends to treat prisoners inhumanely.

    Grave breaches of the Geneva Conventions constitute war crimes, for which individuals can be punished under the US War Crimes Act. Willful killing, torture or inhuman treatment, and willfully causing great suffering or great bodily harm are grave breaches.

    The torture and inhuman treatment of prisoners in US custody at Abu Ghraib and elsewhere in Iraq are grave breaches of Geneva, and therefore, war crimes. The execution of unarmed civilians at Haditha and in other Iraqi cities are war crimes.

    Commanders in the chain of command, all the way up to the commander in chief, can be prosecuted for war crimes if they knew or should have known their inferiors were committing war crimes and failed to stop or prevent them. However, it is unlikely that Attorney General Alberto Gonzales will charge Bush, Cheney or Rumseld with war crimes.

    The United States Is Committing Crimes Against Humanity in Iraq

    Inhumane acts against a civilian population are crimes against humanity and violate the Fourth Geneva Convention. The targeting of civilians and failure to protect civilians and civilian objects are crimes against humanity.

    The dropping of 2,000-pound bombs in residential areas of Baghdad during “Shock and Awe” were crimes against humanity. The indiscriminate US attack on Fallujah, which was collective punishment in retaliation for the killing of four Blackwater mercenaries, was a crime against humanity. The destruction of hospitals in Fallujah by the US military, its refusal to let doctors treat patients, and shooting into ambulances were crimes against humanity. Declaring Fallujah a “weapons-free” zone, with orders to shoot anything that moved, was a crime against humanity.

    Supreme Court Justice Robert Jackson was the chief prosecutor at the Nuremberg Tribunal. He wrote: “No political or economic situation can justify the crime of aggression. If certain acts in violation of treaties are crimes they are crimes whether the United States does them or whether Germany does them, and we are not prepared to lay down a rule of criminal conduct against others which we would not be willing to have invoked against us.”

    The Uniform Code of Military Justice, in articles 90-92, sets forth the duty of military personnel to obey lawful commands. The Nuremberg Principles, which are part of US law, provide that all military personnel have the obligation not to obey illegal orders. The Army Field Manual 27-10, sec. 609 and UCMJ, art. 92, incorporate this principle. Article 92 says: “A general order or regulation is lawful unless it is contrary to the Constitution, the law of the United States â?¦”

    The Bush administration is committing crimes against the peace, war crimes and crimes against humanity in Iraq. Lieutenant Ehren Watada is correct when he says this is an illegal war. I salute his courage.

  • Robin, America has plenty of freedom of speech and freedom of thought, but i’m inclined to believe that pretty much nothing right now will change the administration’s mind. 3 years ago they hadn’t entered this whole mess and thousands and thousands of americans stood up against them, and even then they didnt listen, and that is what i consider to be the height of protest for this war. since then is pretty much apathy amongst 300 million americans. i think that even if bush failed the dover test they’d still do what they’re doing.

    US tends to prefer long wars anyway and it’s only been 3 years. but hey, if iraq runs out of oil tomorrow you will massive US disengagement from the region.

    so there’s always hope.

  • Nas,
    I agree with you 100%. Nothing is going to change this administration’s mind and the really horrible thing is that WHOEVER wins our next election is going to inherit this blankity-blank mess this evil cabal has gotten into. There is NO WAY to get out of this in a clean manner as far as US interests go. Let alone, Iraqi interests (aren’t they REALLY what this whole thing was about? Yeah RIGHT! That’s a BS front if ever there was one). As an American I can honestly tell you that there ARE people out there who feel as strongly about our mistakes if not more so than I. In fact, there are LOTS of them. But even then when certain people do have the right perspective on the Iraqi war, many go astray again in their support for Israel. It is NOT easy being an informed American. Most of the time you just try to muddle your day through being an American and pick one subject/mistake to focus your ire on. But when looked at in it’s entirity, it makes you want to go back to bed and stay there!! I really just wanted to share a little bit of American “possible moment of lucidness” with you. Just a note, Marjorie was very nice to me at first but then got a little snippy when I told her what I wanted to use the speech for, ie, send it to my internet friends in the Middle East (notice her last name) So suffice it to say, it’s HARD BEING AN AMERICAN and there ARE MANY reasons why this is so. Those who DON”T think it is hard being an American are the very reason it IS hard. Our lives are no more precious than any others, and those who think so make me want to vomit!!

Your Two Piasters: